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Discus Egg Issues

Discussion in 'Discus' started by LemonDiscus, Nov 25, 2009.

  1. LemonDiscus

    LemonDiscus Thread Starter Active Member

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    Rick, you might be able to answer this....

    I keep getting what seems to be fertile eggs (opaque with a black dot in the middle) that a few hours before the expected hatch time all turn white with my discus...

    I got rid of the sand in the tank and it is now BB... My water is much more stable now than it was before... here is some of my water info

    Tank:
    PH 6.8
    KH 3.5 dKH
    GH 3 dGH
    Temp 82
    And of course I change 50% of the water in this tank and my others daily or every other day depending on my energy level and mood.

    Tap:
    PH 6.9
    KH 3.5 dKH
    GH 3 dGH

    So that proves my water is stable out of the tap.

    What the heck is going on and do you think it would be worth my while to pick up a bottle of Methaline Blue?
     
  2. cooltow1

    cooltow1 Member

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    Sounds like hardening of the chorion(the outer membrane) of the egg look for a oxidizing agent of some kind. I use Methaline Blue with all my eggs

    Rick
     
  3. LemonDiscus

    LemonDiscus Thread Starter Active Member

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    Is methaline blue and oxidizing agent? I picked up some pimafix... They didnt have methaline blue... would that work?
     
  4. cooltow1

    cooltow1 Member

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    Methaline blue is not an oxidizing agent but is very good anti fungal dye
    pimafix i don't know never used it

    As far as oxidizing agent look for things like Hydrogen Sulfide,Ammonia,Hydrogen Peroxide(Any Peroxide) Or anything your declor may not break down, none of these thing you would put in the water but we use all kinds of chemicals in the water treatment industry. I not sure what the water is like were you live so not sure what treatment process they use.
    With Chorion hardening the egg grow normally to hatch time then fell to hatch or have a very low hatch rate

    Rick
     
  5. cooltow1

    cooltow1 Member

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    Fluoride in your water?

    Rick
     
  6. LemonDiscus

    LemonDiscus Thread Starter Active Member

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    Peroxide would work wouldnt it if dosed properly?

    There may be fluoride? How can I get rid of it?
     
  7. cooltow1

    cooltow1 Member

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    I have never try this but one of the discus breeds in my club swearers by it

    Hydrogen Peroxide or chlorine any disinfectant can work dosed properly
    I only use methylene blue with my eggs but goldfish eggs don't fungus as badly as discus eggs 1) don't need the water flow like cichlids 2) my water is 10 to 20 degrees cooler at breeding time.

    Fluoride is very reactive. Structurally, and to some extent chemically, the fluoride ion resembles the hydroxide ion. It can be filtered out by RO filters


    Rick
     
  8. LemonDiscus

    LemonDiscus Thread Starter Active Member

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    I think I would be more willing to use peroxide with the fish in the tank than pulling the eggs like the guy in your club.

    RO Filters at this time are out of the question.... too much for me...

    I am really starting to see why discus are so expensive... I NEVER imagined the fish being this hard to raise...

    Speaking of raise, this raises another question.... if it IS water quality... How on earth did I get free swimmers 2 times with a different pair?
     
  9. cooltow1

    cooltow1 Member

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    Fluoride is removed by carbon and any declor that contains Sodium Thiosulfate (cheap declor)

    Rick
     
  10. cooltow1

    cooltow1 Member

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    They are super hard Angelfish X100
    You know the drill soft water no more than a GH of 50-60 ppm,
    very clean water, two willing parents. and so on and so on
    But I know very good fish keeper who try for a very long time before they got it just right

    I have access to methylene blue if you would like me to srnd you some
     
  11. LemonDiscus

    LemonDiscus Thread Starter Active Member

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  12. LemonDiscus

    LemonDiscus Thread Starter Active Member

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    No kidding... super hard angelfish!

    I forgot the conversion but I am at 3.5dKH and 3dGH which is soft... so thats covered...

    2 willing parents... I have 2 sets... 1 fully willing every week and 1 willing when they feel like it (about every 2 weeks)

    Clean water covered with the BB tanks and 50% daily or every 2 day WC

    And I am looking into if the Prime I use has Sodium Thiosulfate... I dont run carbon on any tanks... maybe I should? I have it but dont use it usually...
     
  13. LemonDiscus

    LemonDiscus Thread Starter Active Member

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    My two breeding tanks are now loaded up with carbon... I THINK I had carbon in them when I got wigglers before... I dont remember though that seems SO LONG ago... I have TONS of that stuff because... well I just dont usually use it... :)

    I figured it wouldnt hurt to have it in for the breeding tank setups. I know I wont ever use it in my display. I use peat for chemical "filtration" in my display.

    I feel like a mad scientist doing all I do! :confused:

    I have read stories of the number of failed breeding attempts inexperienced discus breeders go through before getting it right... So I dont feel but so bad...

    The biggest issue I am having at this moment (most people NOT on an auto WC system know this) is that when doing my WCs 2 days ago I pulled my back out moving my 7 gallon bucket full of water around for the half hour or so doing them...
     
  14. cooltow1

    cooltow1 Member

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    3dGH X18(17.9)=54ppm so that is OK
    Prime is a complexed hydrosulfite salts you need some cheap declor like Wardy's or Top fin (Sodium Thiosulfate)
    PM me an address I'll mail it dry, mix with a liter of bottled water

    Rick
     
  15. LemonDiscus

    LemonDiscus Thread Starter Active Member

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    Thanks, I appreciate it.
     
  16. LemonDiscus

    LemonDiscus Thread Starter Active Member

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    The activated carbon should also get rid of the fluoride then... so that should be covered... I may not use the peroxide next spawn and just see what happens this time...
     
  17. cooltow1

    cooltow1 Member

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    just be careful with peroxide aspecially in a clean tank it highly reactive and is going to react with something organic, so in a clean tank a little goes a long way

    Rick
     
  18. LemonDiscus

    LemonDiscus Thread Starter Active Member

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    Will do if the carbon does not pull it out. For some reason I think I HAD carbon on these 2 tanks for a while... Habit though of not using it I think I quit putting it in... I make my own filter bags on the old frames for my HOB filter cartridges. And I know I have not done it lately... Maybe that is the missing part why I got it before but now..